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PostPosted: Mon 25 Jul 2016 17:53 pm 
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Split from the Hornby in trouble ? thread
Sounds like corporate waffle to me. :roll:

I just wish Airfix produced something that I actually want to buy and build. :neutral:

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 10:45 am 
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I think that Airfix need to be a little less reliant on WW1/WW2 kits, I understand with the whole centenary years and the upcoming 80th year since WW2, but if you look at how quick the club exclusive Tornado sold out or the club ex. Harriers, maybe they should look at new issues for the Phantom, Bucc and Jaguar as the mkt is flooded with Harriers, Lightnings and Typhoons. Kids love jets, they will grow into prop aircraft but jets grab their imagination and the bigger the better, wait and see how popular the new Victor will be hopefully, a large kit that kids would love. There are so many other issues that effects the popularity of modelling, none more so than price, even I sometimes cringe at the price of some kits, but hopefully with the low oil price comes a drive down in plastic costs and next year Airfix/Hornby have better sales figures. Anyway we can only do what we do best and keep buying those products.


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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 14:18 pm 
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Sgt.Squarehead wrote:
I just wish Airfix produced something that I actually want to buy and build. :neutral:


You know. I'm actually beginning to agree with you. The last Airfix kit that I bought was the 1/72nd Defiant. I've bought Revell and MPC since. Nothing from Airfix has 'tickled my fancy' since.

Although the Airfix brand has always been successful. I have to ponder if Hornby's efforts to re-position Airfix in the market place have been a little too successful. It's not the subject matter that bothers me (Although it is in your case). It's that Airfix no longer appeals to the 'Little Johnny' in me. Overly detailed and complex kits (along with the accompanying price tag) do put me off.

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 15:36 pm 
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So Airfix now issue kits that are too detailed? Remarkable. As I see it they're manufacturing products that befit a leading company in the hobby in the 21st century, whilst providing outstanding value for money. It wasn't that long ago when everybody was moaning about the lack of new products and the execrable decals (they were), Hornby have delivered in spades on several fronts. The main issue I have with Airfix is that I can't keep up with their output!

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 20:13 pm 
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peebeep wrote:
So Airfix now issue kits that are too detailed?


For me. Yes. As far as I'm concerned. Airfix has taken the joy out of model making. If I wanted to buy a detailed model to start with. I would've bought Tamiya, etc. In my humble opinion. Adding detail to a basic model is more fun, because the builder can decide what detail they want. If you don't want that detail. Just slap the parts together.

I admit. I'm an aging 'Little Johnny'. The newer Airfix toolings do nothing for me.

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 21:11 pm 
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Spudgun wrote:
Airfix has taken the joy out of model making.


Airfix have done no such thing, they have simply moved along with the times, all the manufacturers have. You, the consumer, choose what to buy and if Airfix doesn't suit, don't buy. If you're happy to remain time warped in say, 1975, it is perfectly possible to buy old Airfix, Matchbox etc in whatever quantity you wish, but if you think that anybody is going to introduce new products that fit your ideal, you're going to be disappointed.

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 21:52 pm 
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I can't possibly agree. Airfix has re-positioned themselves (not a bad thing) in order to compete with the 'big boys' (not a bad strategy). As a result, Airfix has found favour within within the model making community. The reputation of Airfix has gone up in the estimations of the more deserning model maker. However, there is a down side.

Airfix was once seen as an introduction to model making. Where once Airfix catered to all tastes and abilities, They have now narrowed the demographic with their new toolings. In my opinion, the last tooling produced to cater to the 'little johnnies' of this world was the Mary Rose. How can you draw in a potential client base if you don't produce anything to draw them in?

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 22:16 pm 
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In my experience as an ATC instructor the quality of the kit, good or bad, plain or highly detailed, is irrelevant. The really important thing is the quality of the engagement between the newbie and the person who wishes to introduce them to the hobby. In any case Airfix have plenty of Series 1 and 2 kits in their catalogue that could be regarded as entry level and I'd be happy to give any of the new or recent tooled Series 1-2 kits to a cadet as their first kit. Even the biplanes are designed to go together as painlessly as possible, although they'd be obvious ones to avoid. This argument comes up time and again on forums, as far as I'm concerned from my own experience it has no merit.

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 22:24 pm 
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OK. Fair enough. Since you've mentioned Series 1 and 2 kits. How many series 1 and 2 new tool kits have Airfix released within the last 5 years?

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sat 27 Aug 2016 22:46 pm 
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Quite a few if you look through the catalogue.

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 02:31 am 
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I just want a new 1/72 tank TBH.....They can chuck as much detail at it as they like. :neutral:

I'd even settle for a new 1/48 AFV for the Herrick range, personally I'd like to see some Afghan stuff.....An etched brass bar armour set for their Warrior would be nice too, the plastic parts mar an otherwise excellent model. :?

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 08:27 am 
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Hey Sarge. Were you happy with the Airfix King Tiger?

Let me try and be a little more clear on this 'too much detail' thing. I'm sat here looking at three built new tool kits: The Defiant. The Zero and the Warhawk. All three are excellent for the Series that they were issued as. I would regard them as 'Little Johnny' friendly. I did buy the new tool Do17 (and a couple of other new tool kits. The Me110 being one of them). I opened the box and had a look. Then I put the lid back on. I eventually gave them away.

I'd rather build the old Do217 than the new tool Do17. The Do217 is simpler, but it still looks good when parked on a shelf. I just don't want the extra faff of detailed bomb bays, etc. In my opinion, there just aren't enough of the simpler Series 1 and 2 kits.

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PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 10:00 am 
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The joys of Capitalism. It is corporate waffle Sgt Squarehead, it's a market message but shows that enough institutional investors have faith in what Hornby overall are trying to do. Enough to give them another eight million quid on top of however much they've already seen almost go down the plughole. This will include the Airfix marketing strategy.

I went to a talk by their aircraft research man at Cosford - I think his name was Simon. Others have stated the same elsewhere. The approach seems to be to create a kit of anything that will sell well. WW2 and cold war subjects being high on the popularity list which is why the market is awash. At the time the new WW1 aircraft were "doing ok". They are in it to make money (and right now survive). Chucking loads of cash at cool but niche subjects that don't recoup their investment is a surefire way to put themselves out of business - death by a thousand kits if you will.

As for the level of detail, you are of course free to choose and indeed complain spudgun. I suspect if enough others felt the same way the company would not have gone down in 1986, possibly not 2006 (different circumstances). They clearly take enough of a hit on their sales to invest in more detail, and it seems to be working so on they go.

From what I can see they will never please everyone at once. The poor guy at Cosford gave a great talk then took abuse for 15 minutes about why he wasn't servicing the needs of every specific modeller in the room. Then there is the internet: Your panel lines are too deep. Your kits are too simple. Your kits are too detailed. Your panel line is 2mm out of place. Your artwork isn't exactly the same as it was in the 1960s. I say please keep doing what you're doing Airfix, if it means you will still be here in another 60 years. I hope I will still be just about able to buy your new tool releases with Adam Threedy (Tooby... 3D... eh? :lol: ) for my great grandchildren.

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 10:07 am 
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Sgt.Squarehead wrote:
I'd even settle for a new 1/48 AFV for the Herrick range, personally I'd like to see some Afghan stuff.....An etched brass bar armour set for their Warrior would be nice too, the plastic parts mar an otherwise excellent model. :?
[my emphasis] Airfix did a photoetch set for the Warrior. Dave Cove used it on his review build [ viewtopic.php?f=409&t=41552 ]. Now that the Operation Herrick stuff is being finished off the photo-etch for the Warrior is hard to get.
Perhaps that photo-etch set didn't have all the armour covered though.

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PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 10:31 am 
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Unfortunately, Fred, the Warrior PE did not include replacement brass for the bar armour.

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PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 10:44 am 
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Sgt.Squarehead wrote:
I just wish Airfix produced something that I actually want to buy and build. :neutral:

Doesn´t Airfix do a "wish list" thingy..like Italeri does ?
http://www.italeri.com/news_scheda.asp?idNews=681

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PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 11:02 am 
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Because they are not much use in the end - look what happened to the Revell one that they launched last year, it became a political battlefield with Russians spamming the board to get Russian subjects to the top plus other special interest groups "fixing" their favourite subjects.

If you talk with the marketing guys, they pretty much already know what will be successful as they have other ways of doing their research that doesn't involve internet surveys. Most of these wish list things tend to be a sales gimmick to attract more visitors to the site in the hope they'll buy something rather than a serious market research strategy.

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PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 11:06 am 
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Paul H wrote:
Doesn´t Airfix do a "wish list" thingy..like Italeri does ?

Yes :nod:
http://www.airfix.com/uk-en/forum/wishlists/?p=1

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PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 11:08 am 
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KallistiUK wrote:
Because they are not much use in the end - look what happened to the Revell one that they launched last year, it became a political battlefield with Russians spamming the board to get Russian subjects to the top plus other special interest groups "fixing" their favourite subjects.

If you talk with the marketing guys, they pretty much already know what will be successful as they have other ways of doing their research that doesn't involve internet surveys. Most of these wish list things tend to be a sales gimmick to attract more visitors to the site in the hope they'll buy something rather than a serious market research strategy.

Good Points :thumb:

Ratch wrote:

Thanks :thumb:

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Last edited by Paul H on Sun 28 Aug 2016 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Hornby in trouble ?
PostPosted: Sun 28 Aug 2016 11:08 am 
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fred wrote:
Sgt.Squarehead wrote:
I'd even settle for a new 1/48 AFV for the Herrick range, personally I'd like to see some Afghan stuff.....An etched brass bar armour set for their Warrior would be nice too, the plastic parts mar an otherwise excellent model. :?
[my emphasis] Airfix did a photoetch set for the Warrior. Dave Cove used it on his review build [ viewtopic.php?f=409&t=41552 ]. Now that the Operation Herrick stuff is being finished off the photo-etch for the Warrior is hard to get.
Perhaps that photo-etch set didn't have all the armour covered though.


The photoetch fret for the Warrior didn't contain bar armour replacements but webbing and replacement floors amongst other things. its a pity as they only way to do bar armour in 1:48 would be photoetch. I've scratch built bar armour for a Scimitar and Scimitar 2 in 1:35 scale using plastic strip, but I would never consider trying for 1:48. For the limitations involved in manufacturing i think they did a decent enough job with the Warrior's bar armour.

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