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PostPosted: Fri 10 Nov 2006 20:46 pm 
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I just wanted to know about how tou go about spraying finishes to a kit. I've heard that you can spray Klear directly onto a model without thinning (Non?), but can you spray Mattcote directly on or does it need thinners?

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PostPosted: Fri 10 Nov 2006 21:05 pm 
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I brush the Mattcote, even on sprayed models :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri 10 Nov 2006 22:00 pm 
You can spray Klear, but there is not much point since the Klear is designed to shrink on curing and will not leave brush marks. Use a wide flat brush and small amounts of Klear using repeat coats to build up to the required gloss. Should you use Klear in an airbrush then clean immediately after use as it will bung up the works in an instant. Car screen wash is suitable for cleaning.

Mattcote is excellent for spraying, I dilute to proportions of 50% Mattcote, 30% enamel thinner, 20% cellulose thinner. The latter will ensure that all the flatting agent is dispersed. Use misted coats and drying time is very short, but make sure the airbrush is not too far away from the model as orange peel effect becomes a possibility. This should result in a perfectly flat/even coat of varnish with no streaks. For varying degress of sheen add a drop of Gloss or Satincote.

This pic shows a mossie, where I wanted a scruffy, blotchy appearance so I added a tiny drop of pale grey to the mix as described, sprayed an even coat overall, then letting the spray wander over the model at random. You have to be careful as you cannot see the result until it has dried and I had to go back over some of the black undersurfaces with some black.

Image

peebeep


Last edited by peebeep on Fri 10 Nov 2006 22:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri 10 Nov 2006 22:02 pm 
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I always thought it would mess up the finish if you thinned it? Non?

is it alright to spray Klear undiluted? I guess you'd need a quick blast through straigt afterwards to dust out the cobwebs, but in theory, it works right?

Also, when spraying Klear, what effects does it have (if any) on Tamiya Masking Tape? Does it soak up the klear and make the paint bleed? Or does it just get a coat of Klear on top?

I was thinking of Masking the canopy on my P-51 instead of using a cocktail stick for a change.

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PostPosted: Fri 10 Nov 2006 22:20 pm 
I doubt that Mattcote will spray successfully without some thinner, in any case it tends to be more syrupy because of the matting agent. In my experience very few paints or varnishes, apart from those that are specifically designed to do so (because they are more like inks), can be sprayed without thinning. Thinning will not harm the required finish from any of the Humbrol Cotes, although for glossing I would use Klear in any case because it cures rapidly and doesn't need to be airbrushed. Klear can be sprayed undiluted but thinning with a drop of water and the smallest speck imagineable of washing-up liquid will help it through the brush. Have you got Swanny's web site address? This is one of the best guides for using Klear/Future.

There is no need to mask up canopies when using Klear, a coat of Klear will make them really sparkle. Many modellers dip the canopy in Klear as a matter of course. I don't know what effect Klear might have on the various masking media you might be using.

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PostPosted: Fri 10 Nov 2006 23:27 pm 
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I dip my canopies in Klear around 2 or 3 times. It stops them fogging when using poly cement which is very useful.

Thanks for the help,
Owen

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PostPosted: Fri 10 Nov 2006 23:32 pm 
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Well chaps I use vallejo gloss varnish followed by a coat of matt on my models. The good thing about that is it comes in spay can form so there is no faffing about:)


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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 15:07 pm 
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All the Cote products require thinning before spraying. Matt Cote is very thick due to the high matting agent content, typically I thin 50/50 with White spirits. Gloss Cote can be thinned 70/30 as it does not contain matting agents. I spray at about 15-20psi with a badger 150 with a medium needle. I leave 24 hours between coats to allow it to dry thoroughly. To achieve a gloss finish takes about 3 thin sprays with Gloss Cote. To completely matt a model down again takes 3 thin sprays with matt coat. To achieve a satin finish you can use Satin Cote, or just apply 1 or 2 Matt Cotes to a glossed model.

I find the mixing and spraying (particularily with Matt Cote) is much easier if I warm the bottles up before hand.

I gather you can airbrush Klear undiluted, but have to be careful as it dries very quickly in the airbrush and can be difficult to remove - you require and ammonia based cleaning product as per the label.

Hope this is helpful. (Caveat, this is all based on my experience - as they say, your mileage may vary)

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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 15:33 pm 
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thebuisnessman wrote:
Also, when spraying Klear, what effects does it have (if any) on Tamiya Masking Tape? Does it soak up the klear and make the paint bleed? Or does it just get a coat of Klear on top?

I was thinking of Masking the canopy on my P-51 instead of using a cocktail stick for a change.


Some people actually spray Klear on the masking tape before spraying colour. The Klear actually helps prevent the paint seeping under the tape. (this was a technique used before the wonderful Tamiya product appeared).
Well worth trying. But always clean out your airbrush (using Ammonia) immediately after spraying Klear - otherwise you will soon find that you are in trouble.
Ron.


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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 16:06 pm 
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Thanks for all the help guys. I don't think I'll bother spraying Klear due to the quick drying time. Spraying MattCote is interesting, and if I can source the necasary thinners, I'll try spraying it.

Many Thanks,
Owen

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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 16:46 pm 
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I have sprayed Klear on a couple of kits, and to be honest there really was no great difference between brushing it on, so for my last few kits I have gone back to brushing as it is a lot less hassle.

However .....

When I brush my Klear, I use a good quality brush ( A sable No 6 "cats paw" ) which I use only for Klear and nothing else. I look after it religiously as it was close to a tenner to buy! and when I am applying the Klear I am very careful to stick to a set plan to avoid overbrushing the same area twice and risking getting a difference in finish when it drys.

Also, I found that after dipping and polishing my clear parts to get the finish I liked, spraying more Klear over the top took the edge off the finish. With brushing, I can avoid areas where I am already happy with the finish without doing even more blooming masking


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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 17:21 pm 
BTW Gnome...

What do you clean your brush with please?

And also, when 'dipping' canopies, do you just dunk it or leave it in for a few minutes?


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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 17:23 pm 
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I dunk 'em and leave 'em!

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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 17:33 pm 
Ayup Owen...

How long for? until the Klear goes solid?


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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 17:38 pm 
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I dip them in so they are fully submerged, then let them dry out on a bit of tin foil.

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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 17:40 pm 
Ayup Owen, thanks...


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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 18:18 pm 
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Ayup Fea

Cleaning my beloved Klear brush ... I let it soak in a a dish of warm water with a dash of fairy liquid for a few minutes, then take it out, squeeze the bristles through finger and thumb to make sure all the Klear is gone, a quick dip ... shape the bristles and let it air dry.

Canopy dipping. I have an old take away curry tub that I have filled with Klear. First thing I do when I start a kit is wash the clear sprue in soapywater and dry as normal, give it a quick polish to make sure it is as clean as can be then I just drop it in the tub and, seal the lid and leave it until I am ready for it. This can be quite a time, sometimes as long as two weeks or more, and I often have canopies from 3 or 4 kits in at the same time.

When I take it out though I give it a good flick. I have found that if I just take it out, lay it down and let it dry, you can get concentrations of Klear building up at the bottom of the canopy if it does not drain away. So I always give the sprue a few good "flicks", like throwing a frisbee but not letting go!!! to get the excess Klear off before I set it down to dry. Make sure all parts are firmly attached to the sprue though ;) and when I put it down to dry I always put another old curry container over the top to prevent dust setlling on the sprue.

Eeekkk ..... is that my AMS coming back !!!!!!! :p


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PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006 18:24 pm 
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All for some clear bits of plastic eh? I think that is a serious case of AMS you've got the RG!

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PostPosted: Sun 12 Nov 2006 13:51 pm 
Ayup RG....


Thanks again my wonderful friend. I can now get started on my Harrier Canopies...

(and all the others!)

Thanks again.


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PostPosted: Sun 12 Nov 2006 14:38 pm 
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thebuisnessman wrote:
All for some clear bits of plastic eh? I think that is a serious case of AMS you've got the RG!


It's just an excuse to buy more curries! :wink:

Dave

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