Airfix Logo

Humbrol Logo

The Airfix Tribute Forum was established in April 2006 to discuss the making of Airfix models.

Email: admin at airfixtributeforum.co.uk

It is currently Tue 19 Sep 2017 16:22 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 86 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Natural Metal Finish
PostPosted: Fri 14 Sep 2007 11:18 am 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
Ok,

I have been looking on the web, and reading many sites on NMF, and it seems that it's possibly one of the most difficult finishes to achieve.

Only reason I'm asking is because I have a rattle can of polished chrome colour, and I;m itching to use it, but from what I've read, it will look nasty if the surface isnt flawless... I also have the humbrol metalcote polished aluminium.

Soo, I was thinking of spraying the whole plane with the silver chrome rattle can as a primer and then hand painting the metalcote polished aluminum over that?.

Or Im heading for disaster, as I really dont want to have to strip the pain again an all that. but I would love an EASY natural metal finish, at least somewhere on the plane.

It's a P-51 mustang 1/72


Last edited by red electric on Sun 16 Sep 2007 13:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Natural Metal Finish
PostPosted: Fri 14 Sep 2007 12:04 pm 
Offline
Site Owner
User avatar

Joined: Sat 22 Apr 2006 07:32 am
Posts: 62031
Location: Northampton UK
: Site Owner
: Administrator
: Group Build Guru
: Group Build Leader
: Model Portfolio
red electric wrote:
I have a rattle can of polished chrome colour, and I;m itching to use it, but from what I've read, it will look nasty if the surface isnt flawless... I also have the humbrol metalcote polished aluminium.

Soo, I was thinking of spraying the whole plane with the silver chrome rattle can as a primer and then hand painting the metalcote polished aluminum over that?.

Or Im heading for disaster, as I really dont want to have to strip the pain again an all that. but I would love an EASY natural metal finish, at least somewhere on the plane.

It's a P-51 mustang 1/72

I've not attempted that method you suggest :roll: but on this P-38 the individual panels have been picked out in Hu: 27001 & 27002 and buffed with a cotton bud.
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
IIRC, Radio Gnome has tried Alclad and Hangartime uses another method :shrug:

_________________
Living the dream
My Portfolio
My current Workbench


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Natural Metal Finish
PostPosted: Fri 14 Sep 2007 12:08 pm 
red electric wrote:
Or Im heading for disaster, as I really dont want to have to strip the pain again an all that. but I would love an EASY natural metal finish, at least somewhere on the plane.


There are no short cuts to good silver or bare metal finishes. All joints will need to be filled and any blemishes sanded out. I polish the plastic with a denim cloth before painting.

There is no substitute for spraying - and that is with all due respect to those who get good silver finishes painted by old fashioned brush. I would not mix the finishes as you describe, either use the rattle can or brush paint over matt grey primer. In my experience grey primer is likely to give the best result for brushing and you need to try and do it in one coat with the minimum number of brush strokes. I have never had much success overcoating silver paints, the solvent always seems to attack the first coat of paint. Obviously this advice is contrary to normal brush painting procedures.

If you've no airbrush then rattle cans are probably the best way forward. I use the Halfords paint and they work well using silver paint over the grey primer (also from their rattle can range).

Here's a couple of models that turned out reasonably successfully using the method described above:

Image

Image

Ratch wrote:
IIRC, Radio Gnome has tried Alclad and Hangartime uses another method :shrug:


I have not tried Alclad myself, but the results achieved with it are stunning - but it has to be airbrushed. Likewise with the Snj system, which I have used myself and is very good. The latter comes with buffing powder which is great for getting really bright surfaces.

peebeep


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri 14 Sep 2007 12:31 pm 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
Hi Ratch & Peebeep,

I just spotted a typos in my post "Strip the pain" lol,

Anyway, The metal finish on all the pics looks awsome, it's actually moved me more in the direction of attempting a metal look. I did a quick test just now, but still waiting for it to dry so not sure what it will look like yet.

I have to ask peebeep, but it is just the light in the pic, or is that lightning ~(if it is a lightning) lilac?.. my girlfriend loved it:) she will have me paiting them pink and all kinds of rainbow colours now:s...

Anyway, looking at both your pics the finish is well acceptable for what I need and from that, there is a good chance it could just work but like you say I will probably use grey primer, then maybe seal it with klear first to create a nice smooth coat? Then spray with the silver.

Maybe I will just do some of it silver in case it doesnt look too great. Thanks for the pics, they look great:)

I will update this post, when the paints dryer and I got an idea of how *(it may) turn out.

M

_________________
"don't think the force luke, don't analyze the force luke, FEEL the force luke..."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri 14 Sep 2007 13:39 pm 
Offline
Two Gold & Bronze Stars
Two Gold & Bronze Stars
User avatar

Joined: Tue 25 Apr 2006 15:26 pm
Posts: 6536
Location: Conwy, Wales.
: --------------------
: Administrator
: Group Build Leader
: Model Portfolio
: Airfix Modelling SIG Administrator
I used Rub'n Buff for the NMF on my aborted Boeing Clipper.

It gave a very nice finish, but as with a lot of these things it is very unforgiving of poor preparation. I would suggest that good sanding and a prior coat of gloss to ensure an even surface would be a good start.

_________________
Adrian

Portfolio
Work in (glacial) Progress


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri 14 Sep 2007 14:06 pm 
red electric wrote:
I have to ask peebeep, but it is just the light in the pic, or is that lightning ~(if it is a lightning) lilac?


LOL, that is a trick of the light, late afternoon sunshine through the bedroom window (best spot in the house for lighting and I can set up a temporary studio set up on the bed). It is a Lightning T55 BTW.

red electric wrote:
I will probably use grey primer, then maybe seal it with klear first to create a nice smooth coat? Then spray with the silver.


There is no need to coat with Klear if you use the Halford's primer, it sprays on just fine. The silver paint gets a good 'bite' onto the bare primer. All the paint is sprayed on in light coats, I especially try to avoid the top coat silver from pooling. I would presume that the Halford's system is developed to work best without using additional coatings.

peebeep


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri 14 Sep 2007 14:10 pm 
farmroad38 wrote:
I used Rub'n Buff for the NMF on my aborted Boeing Clipper.


It gives a nice finish but the biggest snag is that it is easily damaged. Even light handling will spoil it and it is a very difficult material to seal in permanently.

One tip for using Rub 'n Buff is to mix it with a drop of thinner and paint it on to achieve chrome like surfaces - it is still very fragile, though.

peebeep


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 11:54 am 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
Ok,

I looked at what tools I had etc, and decided to prime it with grey primer, I let that dry overnight , and I just sprayed it chrome/silver with a rattle can as from testing that gave the best looking metal finish.

But... I boo booed. overall it actually looks ok, but I sprayed a bit too much at the front end, and its concealed some of the detail and you can tell its much thicker there than the rest of the plane.

so I'm not quite sure how to rememdy this? should I let it dry completely then sand it with fine sandpaper, or try and remove the paint? etc.

M


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 13:59 pm 
Offline
Silver Star
Silver Star
User avatar

Joined: Sat 22 Apr 2006 16:42 pm
Posts: 1645
Location: Glamorgan
: --------------------
: Airfix Modelling SIG Member
If you have sprayed at a bit too thickly and obscured surface detail then sanding won't really help.

You can either strip the paint off and start over, or write it down to experience and go on to the next kit.

If you want to strip the paint, Mr Muscle oven cleaner is said to work well amongst other things. Do a search on paint stripping and you should find some usefull stuff in the forum.

When your spraying from a can or a brush there is one golden rule.

3 thin coats will beat 1 thick coat every single time!

once your primers dry, spray your first coat on very lightly ... just mist it on from at least 18 inches away. Give it 5 minutes to begin to dry, then mist a second coat on again from about 18 inches. Another 5 minutes then add a final light coat. Its important to keep your distance with a rattle can as they are quite fierce and its so easy to get a little too close and cause a big orrible run or get it too thick.

With airbrushes at lower pressure you can get in a lot closer

edit/ and don't forget when your using spray cans you really need a mask. At the very least one of those reinforced cardboard ones you can get from B&Q.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 14:06 pm 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
Hi Radio Gnome,

Yeah, i thought it was a light coat:s.. the rest of the plane looks fine, just right at the very front I think it pooled, and silly me tried to wipe it off and though "oh I will just repaint that after" but looking at it i'm not sure that will be the case.

so it sounds like I dont really have much option to but to strip the paint.. do you think If I just rubbed the area where it pooled with acetone or turps etc, then resprayed that area that would work? I know it probably wouldnt match the rest of the plane then in finish, but hopefully some of the decals may cover that area..

I'm not sure..

_________________
"don't think the force luke, don't analyze the force luke, FEEL the force luke..."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 14:21 pm 
Offline
Site Owner
User avatar

Joined: Sat 22 Apr 2006 07:32 am
Posts: 62031
Location: Northampton UK
: Site Owner
: Administrator
: Group Build Guru
: Group Build Leader
: Model Portfolio
When I had a dodgy finish on this B-17 wing
Image
I got away with using white spirit to remove the paint, and sanding back before respraying :roll:
I suppose the effectiveness of white spirit will depend on the paint used and how it has adhered to the surface :shrug:

_________________
Living the dream
My Portfolio
My current Workbench


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 14:27 pm 
Offline
Silver Star
Silver Star
User avatar

Joined: Sat 22 Apr 2006 16:42 pm
Posts: 1645
Location: Glamorgan
: --------------------
: Airfix Modelling SIG Member
If its a small area it may well be worth trying to sand it down a bit and lightly respraying the area. You may lose a little surface detail, but its easier than stripping the whole thing.

be careful with white spirit though, use very sparingly on a cotton wool bud if you have to use it at all, and don't sand until it is totally dry.

Good luck


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 14:30 pm 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
Hi Ratch,

From a test peice the other day, the silver seemed to come off ok with white spirit, but the difference being, I hadn't primed the test piece, so whether that will make a difference or not the ashesion this time im not sure.

But I think I will try that, would be a shame to have to strip the whole plane, because the rest of the finish turned out ok, just one lil bit at the front.

The instructions on the can say "fast drying" but it doesnt give an exact time, so Im not sure whether to leave it overnight because I will have to handle the plane to some degree to get the paint off the front. though Im thinking of picking up some very soft cotton gloves tommorrow so as not to leave finger prints.

What happened to the tail plane in your pic?

_________________
"don't think the force luke, don't analyze the force luke, FEEL the force luke..."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 14:34 pm 
Offline
Site Owner
User avatar

Joined: Sat 22 Apr 2006 07:32 am
Posts: 62031
Location: Northampton UK
: Site Owner
: Administrator
: Group Build Guru
: Group Build Leader
: Model Portfolio
red electric wrote:
What happened to the tail plane in your pic?

It's part of the battle damage inflicted on it :twisted:

_________________
Living the dream
My Portfolio
My current Workbench


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 14:45 pm 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
I thought so, Just wasnt completely sure, as te rest of the diarama (to me ) looked pristine. It looks spot on!.. I really want to have a go at doing a diarama, but better the hang of the basics first.. and make some space.

_________________
"don't think the force luke, don't analyze the force luke, FEEL the force luke..."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 18:48 pm 
red electric wrote:
The instructions on the can say "fast drying" but it doesnt give an exact time


The Halford's rattle cans are touch dry within 20-30 minutes, but I wouldn't risk too much handling until they've had a good few hours curing. Using gloves is a really good idea.

peebeep


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun 16 Sep 2007 18:53 pm 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
Thanks PeeBeep,

Yeah, I've done that already, a few times.. I thought "oh this feels dry already wow.. etc," then next min I spot a hugeeee thumbprint in my nice paint work.

The can I used is actually from wilkinsons, (wilkies) as halfords is miles away from where I live, but next chance I get i will deffo get some of their sprays, as everyone seems to swear by it.:)

M

_________________
"don't think the force luke, don't analyze the force luke, FEEL the force luke..."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue 18 Sep 2007 07:19 am 
Offline
Gold & Bronze Stars
Gold & Bronze Stars
User avatar

Joined: Mon 24 Apr 2006 01:08 am
Posts: 3005
Location: Adelaide, Australia
: Moderator
: Group Build Guru
: Model Portfolio
My first metal finish was on the Airfix 1/72 Fairy Rotodyne. After getting a smooth finish with Humbrol 1 primer, I sprayed a coat of Klear and then a coat of Humbrol 27002 Polished Aluminium. It came out great. I sprayed a coat of Klear to seal the finish, but handling rubbed this away. I would recommend spraying two coats of Klear to seal the finish. I had no problems respraying Polished Aluminium, once the surface was sealed with Klear.

_________________
If you would like Airfix to release a 1/600 kit of HMS Dreadnought,
the world's first all-big-gun battleship, then please vote here!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue 18 Sep 2007 14:36 pm 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Fri 24 Aug 2007 13:55 pm
Posts: 205
Location: Warrington
Hi Steven,

I love that review you did of the build etc, Was really interesting, and the finish looks great. I'm thinking there are just some things you really need an airbrush for as the silver I tried with the rattle cans didint really work out. The finish was ok but it didint look realistic, it looked like the plane was made out of tinfoil.:s..

I did get some nice weathering effects though by painting over it in brown, then scraping some of the paint off, so I shall continue with the model until completion I think on that theme.

but I am going to try it again, as i dont want to be limited by not being able to do NMF even though I dont have an airbrush, so next time I will follow your advice and make sure its well sealed..

M

_________________
"don't think the force luke, don't analyze the force luke, FEEL the force luke..."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 19 Sep 2007 04:02 am 
Offline
Gold & Bronze Stars
Gold & Bronze Stars
User avatar

Joined: Mon 24 Apr 2006 01:08 am
Posts: 3005
Location: Adelaide, Australia
: Moderator
: Group Build Guru
: Model Portfolio
I'm glad to hear that you found my review helpful. Good luck with your next metal finish!

_________________
If you would like Airfix to release a 1/600 kit of HMS Dreadnought,
the world's first all-big-gun battleship, then please vote here!


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 86 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group

The Airfix Tribute Forum

The Airfix Tribute Forum - Est. 2006 | Make a Donation


modelsforsale.com