Airfix Logo

Humbrol Logo

The Airfix Tribute Forum was established in April 2006 to discuss the making of Airfix models.

Email: admin at airfixtributeforum.co.uk

It is currently Fri 22 Sep 2017 16:08 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu 06 Oct 2016 11:50 am 
Offline
Gold & Bronze Stars
Gold & Bronze Stars

Joined: Sun 14 Feb 2016 00:00 am
Posts: 3491
Location: South Australia (Ex Brit)
: --------------------
I have recently posted on my Portfolio, some models pics of Japanese Aircraft that where designed to be carried aboard Japanese Submarines. Whilst researching them, I found some very interesting material on the web about the Submarines which carried them. So here are a couple of the pics, and a bit of history about them.

Image
Image
Yokosuka E 14 Y1 "Glen", aboard the IJN Submarine I 7, 17th December 1941. This Aircraft Photographed Pearl Harbor after, the attack. The Submarine I7, and her sister where launched in 1935, and where designed to carry a watertight compartment aft of the conning tower to accommodate the "Glen". At the time they where the largest and fastest Submarine's in the IJN. She could do 23 knots surfaced, but only 8 submerged, and had a range of 14,000 nautical miles. The I7-8, were armed with 6 Torpedo Tubes forward. I-7 career came to end when she was attacked by USS Monaghan on 22 June 1943, off the Aleutian Islands. Her sister I-8 was sunk during the Okinawa landings.

Another famous "Glen", was that carried by I-25, (the alternative model, to the MPM kit I built). The I-25, was a larger class again, from the I-7/8, and could travel under water faster, (14knots). The I-25, was patrolling the waters off the coast of Oahu, during the Pearl Harbor attack, unlike the surface fleet the Submarine fleet, ( 8 altogether), sailed to the west coast of the United States, with the intention, of shelling the coast on Christmas Eve, (any-one seen the Steven Spielberg Movie 1941?), but due to Anti Sub Patrols the attack was abandoned, and I-25 sailed home to refuel/re-supply.

Her second voyage was 5th February 1942, and she was to reconnoitre, the Harbour's of Sydney, Melbourne, Hobart, Auckland and Wellington. On the 13the February, she sank the Merchant Ship Derrymore, and on the 14the of February, was only a few miles off the N.S.W. coast, near Sydney. Due to rough weather they could not launch the "Glen", so submerged during the day, and surfaced at night. Finally on Tuesday 17th February 1942 Warrant Flying Officer Nubuo Fujita, took off and flew over Sydney photographing its defences and shipping, returned to the I-25, where he and his plane, was recovered, stowed aboard, and the I-25 headed south.

He next reconnoitred Port Phillip bay on the 26th February, and then Hobart, on 1st March. I=25 reached Wellington on the 8th March, and Auckland on the 13th, then Fiji on the 17th. After this the I-25 returned to Yokosuka on the 5th April, for a refit.

The 22nd May saw the I-25, off the Aleutian Islands, and its "Glen", photographing Kodiak Bay, and on the night of 20th June off the coast of Washington, where she Torpedoed the Canadian Freighter "Fort Camoson", her crew was picked up the next day, and the freighter was towed for repairs. On the 21st June I-25 followed a fishing boat fleet, into the Columbia River in Oregon, and fired 17 shells into Fort Stevens. I have no information, on the rest of I-25's voyage after this.

Her 4th voyage began on the 15th August. Leaving Yokosuka the I-25 sailed off the coast of Oregon, and the "Glen", was launched with Fujita at the controls, this time the "Glen" was armed with 2 76kg incendiary bombs. The idea was to start "wildfires", in the forests. Quick thinking Fire Spotters, extinguished the flames before the fire could take hold. This was the only case of the U.S. mainland being bombed. Fujita tried a second time, but no results were recorded.

On the 4th October the I-25 Torpedoed the Tanker "Cambden", but it was destroyed, whilst salvage attempts were made a few days later. The next night the Tanker "Larry Doheny", was Torpedoed and sunk by the I-25. Two Submarines were sighted on the night of 11th October 1942, and the I-25 used its last Torpedo to sink one of them. It was wrongly reported as U.S., but in fact it was the Russian L-16, along with the L-15, had sailed from Vladivostok, and heading to San Francisco, via the Panama Canal, but since Russia was neutral with Japan, at this time, the incident was kept quiet.

The I-25's luck ran out on 3rd September 1943. She was sunk off the New Hebrides, by the USS Ellett.
Mike


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri 07 Oct 2016 02:18 am 
Offline
Gold & Bronze Stars
Gold & Bronze Stars

Joined: Sun 14 Feb 2016 00:00 am
Posts: 3491
Location: South Australia (Ex Brit)
: --------------------
PT2.

With the success, of the Yokosuka "Glen", a much bigger Aircraft was ordered, with much bigger Submarines to carry them. So in 1942 a new class of Submarine was ordered, the I-400 series. These boats where the largest built in WW2, and where until the Nuclear Subs, came along in the 60's. Originally 18 were to be built, but were scaled back to 5, then finally 3. The I-400, was launched 1st January 1943, at the Kure yard Hiroshima. She was 122m long,12m beam, and a draft of 7m. She was powered by 4 Diesel, and 2 electric motors, giving her a top surfaced speed, of 18.9 knots, and a submerged speed of just 6.5 knots. Armament consisted of 3 Aichi M6A1 floatplanes, 8 forward torpedo Tubes, 1 14cm naval gun, 3 X 25mm triple mounted cannon, and 1 25mm cannon.

Now for the Aircraft
Image
Image
This is the Aichi M6A1-K Nanzan. THis was designed to train the pilots for the Seiran. With the absence of the floats, the large foldable rudder was removed. There was only 2 Aircraft built, one of which found its way to the U.S., after the war.

Image
Image
THe Aichi M6A1 Seiren. basically the same as the Nanzan, but with folding gear, and detachable floats. The crew of the submarine could have these planes, assembled and ready for launching in 7 minutes. The Seiren, was launched via a catapult along the forward deck. to allow this, the conning tower of the I-400 was offset to port, which created, all sorts of maneuvering problems, (affected by wind, and easily picked up on radar).

Proposed attack on the Panama Canal:
In 1943 Captain Chikao Yamamoto, and Commander Yasuo Fujimori conceived the idea, of attacking the lock gates of the Panama Canal, to restrict the flow of supplies, and equipment, from America, into the Pacific. The plan was for 4 Aircraft carrying Submarines, (the I- 400, 491, and I-13,14), to travell, to the gulf of panama, launch their planes, without floats, attack the gates, and return to the Submarines, and ditch, where the crews would be picked up. However, time and the war turned against the Japanese, so by April 1945,Captain Ariizumi, who had been appointed to command the attack, decided for the pilots to make a "Kamikaze" attack instead. However, this was not accepted by some pilots, but training went on regardless, however the winds of mis-fortune blew against the Japanese again.

Ulithi Attack.
Just when everything was in readiness for the Panama Canal attack, the Americans invaded Okinawa. So it was decided that the strike force would attack the 8 American Carriers supposedly in Ulithi Atoll instead, and of course it was going to be a "Kamikaze" attack. Fortunatly the war came to an end before this took place, and the Japanese Surrendered.

The Japanese Submarines were captured (24 in total), by the Americans, and were taken to Sasebo Bay, for inspection. Unfortunately the Russians had demanded that the captured Submarines, and information be shared. So the Americans packed their captured booty with explosives, towed them out to point designated as "Point deep Six", (about 35km South East of Fukure Island), and Sunk. So ended an unusual chapter in Aviation History.

Mike


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri 07 Oct 2016 12:22 pm 
Offline
Blue Star
Blue Star

Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2016 09:55 am
Posts: 517
Location: Scotland
: --------------------
Thanks for this; are there any currently available kits of the relevant submarine classes?

_________________
"Is there anything I can do to help you?"
"Yes. Give me a staffel of Spitfires!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 09 Oct 2016 14:05 pm 
Offline
Two Gold & Bronze Stars
Two Gold & Bronze Stars
User avatar

Joined: Fri 23 Apr 2010 19:46 pm
Posts: 6298
Location: NRW
: --------------------
: Portfolio
Submarines as aircraft carriers!! :shock: The things one learns :)
I´d never heard (or imagined it possible) of these before so thanks for the info :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

edit. I got interested and Just found this on them
http://www.combatreform.org/submarineai ... rriers.htm

_________________
I knew the truck didn´t want to hit me....it had Dodge written on the front!
(32 down - 27 to go)
My ATF Portfolio
My ATF Workbench


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon 10 Oct 2016 13:35 pm 
Offline
Blue Star
Blue Star

Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2016 09:55 am
Posts: 517
Location: Scotland
: --------------------
It wasn't just the IJN either; the British converted two of the K-boats (steam-engined submarines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_K-class_submarine ) into seaplane carriers, and a third into a heavy shore bombardment vessel.
The French also built one, the Surcouf ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_submarine_Surcouf ) and which has been kitted at least twice.

_________________
"Is there anything I can do to help you?"
"Yes. Give me a staffel of Spitfires!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 11 Oct 2016 03:41 am 
Offline
Gold & Bronze Stars
Gold & Bronze Stars

Joined: Sun 14 Feb 2016 00:00 am
Posts: 3491
Location: South Australia (Ex Brit)
: --------------------
That's right Paws4thot, the British did, and one of them sank when they did not shut the hanger door properly, (with the loss of all hands), I remember watching a doco, on it. To answer your previous post, I have had a quick look on "flea-bay", and you are in luck. Aoshima, Tamiya, Hobby Boss, Skywave, and MRC, make the I-400/401, in either waterline, or full hull, and in either 1/350, or 1/700.Eduard, Voyager, and Toms, make upgrades, for the 1/350 scale kits. Aoshima make the I-16, Academy, do the U.S.S. Indianapalosis,(scuse spelling), and the I-58,1/350, as a set, and it does not say who makes it, but you can get the I-20, with mini sub, (that was launched and intercepted, and sunk), on the Pearl Harbor attack, in 1/350 scale.
Mike


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 11 Oct 2016 13:02 pm 
Offline
Blue Star
Blue Star

Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2016 09:55 am
Posts: 517
Location: Scotland
: --------------------
Cheers, and expanding on my last, Heller (bien sur) did a Surcouf, and the other one is by Hobby Boss ( 1/350, includes some etched rails, and flag decals).

BTW It's Indianapolis.

_________________
"Is there anything I can do to help you?"
"Yes. Give me a staffel of Spitfires!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 11 Oct 2016 16:03 pm 
Offline
Black Star
Black Star

Joined: Wed 28 Jan 2009 12:10 pm
Posts: 14
Arado Ar-231 was an aeroplane in a tube. Didn't fly very well. Special Hobby did/do 1/48 scale kit.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 11 Oct 2016 23:47 pm 
Offline
Gold & Bronze Stars
Gold & Bronze Stars

Joined: Sun 14 Feb 2016 00:00 am
Posts: 3491
Location: South Australia (Ex Brit)
: --------------------
Thanks mrcrazy, Pavla also make a 1/72 scale version, (see page 7 of my portfolio).
Mike


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed 12 Oct 2016 09:46 am 
Offline
Silver Star
Silver Star
User avatar

Joined: Thu 25 Feb 2010 15:48 pm
Posts: 1372
Location: Enfield
Heller have reboxed the surcouf with extra resin and photo etch so you can build her in her early and late guises.

_________________
I am the cat of cats, the everlasting cat, cunning and old and sleek as jam


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 05 Mar 2017 02:17 am 
Offline
Green Star
Green Star

Joined: Sun 16 Aug 2015 17:39 pm
Posts: 225
: --------------------
I had read about the I-400 class and thier demise at the hands of the americans years ago but knew nothing of the others , thanks for sharing the info

_________________
If life gives you POTATOS & LEMONS
Make VODKA & LEMONADE!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed 08 Mar 2017 19:31 pm 
Offline
Blue Star
Blue Star
User avatar

Joined: Sun 18 Jun 2006 09:02 am
Posts: 515
Location: Dorset
Paws4thot wrote:
It wasn't just the IJN either; the British converted two of the K-boats (steam-engined submarines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_K-class_submarine ) into seaplane carriers, and a third into a heavy shore bombardment vessel.
The French also built one, the Surcouf ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_submarine_Surcouf ) and which has been kitted at least twice.

Just spotted this thread. As far as I can recall from some research I did into this years ago, the story that they were converted K class (which is the popularly accepted view by many) is incorrect. The last batch of the K class was cancelled due to problems with earlier boats and the only connection between the K class and the M class which were smaller by about 500 tons and 40 odd feet in length was their slot in the ship building programme. Unlike the Ks that were steam powered, the Ms were conventional diesel-electric propulsion. Only 3 were completed (the 4th being cancelled while still on the slipway) with single 12 inch guns recovered from the battlecruisers that had been converted to aircraft carriers. One of those, M2, was later converted to a seaplane carrier but sank in Lyme Bay with the loss of its tiny Parnell Peto seaplane.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu 09 Mar 2017 09:30 am 
Offline
Silver Bar
Silver Bar
User avatar

Joined: Sun 25 Sep 2011 07:05 am
Posts: 10923
Location: Sydney Australia
: Portfolio
I've built a number of IJN aircraft carrying subs including I-400,
Links here;
viewtopic.php?f=177&t=36215&hilit=aoshima
viewtopic.php?f=177&t=36218&hilit=Tamiya
viewtopic.php?f=177&t=36217&hilit=aoshima
Hope they help :nod:
Cheers gents :cheers:
Neil 8-) 8-)

_________________
" .... mmmmm, the smell of plastic glue, there's so much dried on my fingers I can't feel anything ....... but I finally got this kit finished!!!! "
My Portfolio


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu 09 Mar 2017 16:00 pm 
Offline
Blue Star
Blue Star

Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2016 09:55 am
Posts: 517
Location: Scotland
: --------------------
@wookie - The post you quoted was based partly on a half remembered New English Library history volume that I last read about 30 years ago.

I know enough about shipbuilding to know that a difference of 500 tons can be a difference in propulsion equipment, or hull form, or armament, rather than a different design. What probably closes the difference/similarity between K and M boats after changes in propulsion (where you're correct) and stem and/or stern length is that I'm pretty sure the Ms used materials designed/ordered for the K, such as the same keels.

_________________
"Is there anything I can do to help you?"
"Yes. Give me a staffel of Spitfires!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri 10 Mar 2017 13:17 pm 
Offline
Blue Star
Blue Star
User avatar

Joined: Sun 18 Jun 2006 09:02 am
Posts: 515
Location: Dorset
I'm sure that you're right there because if the contract had been placed, the shipbuilders (and the Navy) would have wanted to recoup any costs already expended on the Ks


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group

The Airfix Tribute Forum

The Airfix Tribute Forum - Est. 2006 | Make a Donation


modelsforsale.com